Moving through Divorce and Beyond with Dr. Sari Green
Episode #14: Moving through Divorce and Beyond with Dr. Sari Green
Dr. Sari Green shares with Dr. Prianca what it felt like to suddenly be left alone in a journey that you started with someone. After discovering her husband’s double life and divorce, Dr. Sari didn’t have much choice to choose but to continue with her life as a single mother and physician. She shares her two cents on post-divorce identity shifts, the pressure of perfection on career women, and the beautiful side of the dismantling effects of divorce on a person’s life.
What you will learn:
Sari Green on how divorce can dismantle everything in your life
Identity shifts after divorce are sometimes forced
Type-A women are allowed to have imperfect track records in career and life
Why you should sit with your feelings
How to reclaim your agency in the midst of not feeling in control
To end burnout and exhaustion and get your peace of mind back, check out her free masterclass on 4 steps to overcome burnout, get rid of overwhelm, and get your peace of mind back.
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[FULL TRANSCRIPTION]
Dr. Prianca Naik
You are listening to the empowering working moms podcast, real talk with Dr. Prianca Naik, a show to help professional moms in survival mode to take hold of their lives and thrive. If you're ready to take powerful action to create your best life, then this is the show for you. I'm your host, Dr. Prianca Naik, a board-certified internal medicine physician, and certified life coach. Now let's get to it and dive in. You're listening to the empowering working moms Podcast, episode number 14. So today I want to welcome our guest, Dr. Sari Green. And because as I mentioned before, I really want to talk about real topics like divorce, abuse, and fidelity, all the things that we cannot talk about at the dinner table with our friends, or maybe we're ashamed of unless we know that other people are in that boat. So let's have Dr. Sari Green talk to us about her journey in divorce and single motherhood as well. She's a physician, a general surgeon with a background in traditional Chinese medicine and Western medicine, a single mom certified life coach, and she's also working non-clinically. In CDI, is what is CDI sorry,
Dr. Sari Green
CDI is clinical documentation improvement. I work as a subject matter expert for a company that provides this service for hospitals.
Dr. Prianca Naik
Very cool. So she has a non-traditional career on top of coaching, she created Lotus coaching to help women shift from surviving to thriving through big disorienting life transitions. With experience with addiction in fidelity and high conflict divorce, she works with women who want to uncover the infinite possibility that's buried under the ruins of their dismantle reality. She provides coaching helping clients release the past, reclaims the present, and create a bright and beautiful future. I'll give you her info, she will give you her website and info at the end. But she can be reached at sari@greenlotuscoaching.com or sarahgreenmd.com links will be in the show notes. So thank you so much for joining us today, Sari.
Dr. Sari Green
Thank you. Thanks for having me. Yeah, be here.
Dr. Prianca Naik
So tell us a little bit about your journey from in a nutshell from beginning to end. Dealing with your divorce.
Dr. Sari Green
I don't know if there's a nutshell, but I will do my best. It's been a while now. Six, six and a half years, maybe I had been through med school been through residency was kind of just out of training. I would gotten married during residency. And I was pregnant, we were starting a family. And I found out when I was four months pregnant, that my husband, my then husband was living a double life. Basically, just kind of overnight, I found this out. And obviously everything kind of fell apart after that. We had we separated at that time and have since divorced. So my journey has been basically one of pain of rebuilding a life rebuilding a family very much in a different way than I had envisioned. You know, I was alone with my son from from birth. And kind of all of the pieces that come with that in terms of what that means for career what that means in terms of support system and where I live and what I do. And I mean, really, it was it was kind of just a complete dismantling of my life. That took a long time to rebuild, but and I don't want to sugarcoat any of it. Because it was really really hard for a lot of years. But you know, a huge dismantling like that allows for you to kind of rebuild however you want, you know, it opens up a world of possibility that's hard to see when you're kind of on this trajectory which especially from medicine is really deeply ingrained, right like you get in this machine and it just kind of continues to pump you through. So it a lot of hard lessons in there and really, really kind of dark and difficult years and you know I'm at a place now where I wouldn't give it up for anything because of where I ultimately you know, am now
Dr. Prianca Naik
I love this description in that it is so real but also so you talk about dismantling, right because people get married They have this idea of what their lives are going to look like there is this structure. And often, especially with social media and posting these picture perfect posts, and people have these curated photos, believing that everybody has this perfect life. And when you think about separating or filing for divorce, it is the shattering of this, what I call facade, because the facade is what people know, as opposed to what's going on, on the inside, in the home, day to day, people have no idea. And the so the shattering of that, and then grieving the loss of the life that you thought you were going to have, is hard, right? Any grief, and it's like a death. But then, as you said, the opportunity to rebuild, which I love so much, because people so often, I've heard people say, Oh, I filed for divorce, and, you know, automatic responses, I'm sorry. But is it really I'm sorry, or congratulations on the start of your new life, where you're going to be free and able to restart out of whatever dysfunction, perhaps that existed that other people have no idea about?
Dr. Sari Green
Yeah, all of those very good points, I think my situation was a little bit different than a lot. And I had people that kind of said, you know, Oh, it must be a relief, you know, after this and in for me, it wasn't because I lived fully in that facade, you know, the reality that I lived in, was that great place, I didn't suspect anything I didn't, you know, it was what I believe to be a really healthy and happy marriage, right. So this was very much underground. In so it was, from my situation, just a really abrupt and unexpected, just like, literally, in an instant, everything fell apart. But I think the stuff that follows is similar, it might have just taken me a little bit longer to get there, because I had to process that kind of, you know, in the therapy that is that is kind of centered around this type of experience. For partners, they call it the reality, ego fragmentation. So kind of this, like, everything that you thought was really wasn't. And that's a very, very disorienting place to be. But your points to the, like grieving the loss of the life that you thought you had, or we're going to have, or we're creating, I think is something that we all go through. And it's difficult to kind of imagine what a future could look like, you know, especially when it happens abruptly. But I think, even when it doesn't happen happen abruptly, there's a point when it, it turns, right, and it's going to need to look different. But I know for me, I didn't have a plan B, I wasn't like, Okay, well, I'm going to be married and have a kid and we're going to have this family, or I'll go off and do it by myself. And either, you know, like I did that trajectory, that kind of vision that was just like a black hole there. So kind of grieving the loss of what I thought was an also allowing space to even consider what a future might look like, was took a long time. And as I said earlier, I don't want to sugarcoat it. Because for people listening, who are really in the acute trauma phase of this, I don't want to gloss over that experience at all. It's really hard and really dark, and you can't just think your way out of it. But I do want people to know that they're they will get through it. And as they go along, kind of the light starts to open up in these opportunities that could only have come from being in this situation start to present themselves. If that makes sense.
Dr. Prianca Naik
It makes complete sense. So some people will have a polarizing, maybe one large event, they were deceived, and they find out and then they'll fight filed for divorce or separation, etc. Somebody and a lot of times I think in those situations, women have that gut instinct that maybe they'll go quiet down that does happen. point being that oftentimes, we are so afraid of what would what would be like, like, not being in the marriage. What would that look like? What's he going to do? Like he won't be a part of my life anymore, or whatever it is. And I think a lot of times in spinning in confusion about missing or losing that partner people will just sit in the same space of kind of one During a not trusting, or even a maybe a different situation from yours, but where they're in a dysfunctional relationship, they know what's wrong, they know what they would tell a friend to do. And yet they can't do it because they're so afraid of the unknown, even though, right? We know every day is unknown. But we create an illusion that we know what's coming tomorrow.
Dr. Sari Green
Yes, yeah, the fear of the unknown is huge, right? The fear of even if you're doing everything, you know, the fear of remember, one of my first responses is going to sound ridiculous, I was the day that I found out, I was sitting there with a couple friends. And he just kept saying, I don't even know how to backup my phone. I don't even know how to backup my you know, because he handled all the techie electric, you know, he would take my electronics and make sure everything, and which is ridiculous, right? Like, obviously, I can figure out how to backup my phone. But like just this idea of having to take on everything yourself, when you had envisioned that this was kind of a shared journey.
Dr. Prianca Naik
Shared journey. And also, when you're at a stage where all of your friends are married, or very, you know, very few divorce people who have children, that can be I think, very isolating as well, feeling like you're alone feeling like you're not the only one. And learning to once you actually do make the decision to split up facing that. And the rebuilding part that you mentioned, rebuilding your tribe, rebuilding your friends circle expanding to people that might be able to meet your needs, because as much as married friends could understand what a divorce person is going through, they're not going to know it fully unless they've experienced it themselves.
Dr. Sari Green
Yeah, I never could have imagined what this would have been like. Without living it. You just mentioned kind of people not being able to relate and rebuilding kind of your support system. And one of the things I think that is really become apparent to me are kind of one of the one of the ways I've started kind of looking back over this and in recognizing both with myself and kind of my journey, but also, that comes up with clients often is, is kind of the identity transformations that come with this. And you know, if you think about identity transformations, there are kind of natural progressive ones during our life, right like that just kind of organically come with as we move through life. And then there's chosen identity transformations like, you know, we chose to become physicians, and it was a transformation to become one right, but it was a chosen something. And then there's forced identity transformations. And that, you know, I didn't choose to be a single mom, I didn't choose to be somebody who is divorced, I didn't choose to be, you know, like, alone with an infant. And what does that mean, you know, and the language that we use, and starting to think about ourselves in a different way, is an interesting and sometimes kind of challenging step as we as we move through it. I know, I initially, I remember a friend of mine, and I've told this story before, I don't know if it was to you or not, but a friend of mine. She said, why don't you just send out, send out a Christmas card with just you and your son and I was like, I can't do that. That's not like, that's not my family, right? And now I do. And now it's a non-issue. And it's the two of us and I'm, this is who I am. And this is who we are. And this is our family and I'm missing them. Right, you know, now I own that identity. But it was such an uncomfortable and unwanted identity for so long and kind of figuring out how to navigate it and the barriers that put up in terms of really leaning in and reaching out for help and kind of building a support system. It's a lot
Dr. Prianca Naik
I'm really glad you brought up the concept of identity shift because most people don't identify themselves as divorcees or single moms, right? They, it's like I'm a person who stays married. I give my marriage my all and in many cultures, cross-cultural Christianity, Catholicism, and Indian culture. Divorce is just not it's it's not supported. It's not done. My parents generation, there are no divorces. So the concept of divorce seems even though we're in the year 2022, it feels so foreign so taboo. And so just the idea for somebody who identifies as a non-divorce or a married person to shift that, it can be so pain Well, and you did say I choose, I chose, I didn't choose this. Well, you you didn't want it. But you did at some point, you did choose to do it because that was the right thing for you, and then shifting yourself to a place where you were empowered that that's what you did. But that was not the vision, right that you had for yourself. That's not a vision that people have.
Dr. Sari Green
Yeah, that's a good distinction. Of course, I chose it, but I didn't, I didn't feel like I had a choice. It's not what I wanted. Right? It's not it's not what I wanted. And it was a, it was an identity that took me a long time to really embody, you know, especially being pregnant. You know, I didn't I wear my ring. Because I was like, what does that say about me if I don't have it on and I'm bright, which is ridiculous, right? You know, I don't ever think that about anybody that I see or won't even notice. But for me, it you know, there was all this layer of, of all the stuff that had happened. I mean, it comes down to shame, right? It's so shameful. Or it felt so shameful. And, in my mind, I knew that this shame was not mine, you know, but it's still I was linked with it. And so I still, you know, it kind of clicked me for a long time until I was actively able to shut it down.
Dr. Prianca Naik
The shame piece also, I personally think come accompanies the type a career woman who, for example, you're a surgeon, I'm an internist. We're physicians, right. That's one category of career, but we're high achieving, we don't fail, we perform. So the idea of, quote, unquote, failing at marriage, which isn't a thing, I don't know why people, I don't I wish people just stop saying that, because it takes two people to, you know, create or dismantle any given relationship but, but just the concept of not getting an A plus by getting divorced and the shame of that, oh, I'm not perfect. Oh, my life's not great, even though it's supposed to be I'm a, I'm a doctor, I'm smart. Like, I'm supposed to have it all together. And if I get a divorce, what are people going to think? Like? Do I have it together? All these silly? Well, maybe not silly, but these are self judgments, right? And this idea that we're not allowed to not have this perfect track record, like outside, as in our personal lives.
Dr. Sari Green
I think for me, that was a really big part of it. You know, I think for a lot of us, I ended up coaching, mostly physicians, just because that's the world that I live in. And we all share a lot of these similar traits, perfectionism, being one of our maladaptive coping mechanisms. I didn't really have an awareness about it before, right? It's like, the thing you put on in an interview as your weakness, right. Perfectionism as if it's a good thing, but as it applies, but as it applies to your life, you know, I had very carefully curated my life, right? I did all the right things, and I made all the right choices. And then it literally just like, it got destroyed, like, just in a moment, you know, and it's, it's a little funny to me now. It's not funny, it's interesting. And like, Yeah, I'm able to really have a step back from it and kind of see the lessons that were in there, right. Like, you don't get to control it all, you know, you can do your best for things. But life is about growing and learning and kind of taking what comes but that perfectionism piece, you know, and maybe for me, this was one of this was a really great way to learn that, right? Like, you thought, because I really felt like I had won the husband lottery, and we had this perfect, cute little family. And it wasn't just social media. Image, like I believed that reality with my whole being, you know, and, and then it all just, you know, blew up in flames in an instant. Another thing that just that came to mind when we were talking about identity is something that I notice, I recognize now in retrospect was a shift for me and I notice it with clients at various stages along their journey is how they refer to themselves and how they refer to their partner or ex partner. And it kind of goes through a progression of, you know, often still calling them my husband, right husband, and then maybe shifting to my soon to be x or my ex or what does it mean? And I remember a moment when my therapist it was I don't know how far in it was but she said Who is he to? You? know, it's like, he's my son's dad. You know, and, and the words that we use are important in creating our own reality, right. And so we are kind of in a default pattern of using language and using words based on reality that no longer exists. And so being really mindful of the words we use about ourselves, and the words we use about our situation, and the words we use about the people around us kind of helped to shape the new reality that we're trying to create.
Dr. Prianca Naik
I like that, I like that you figured out your label, which was my kid's dad, as opposed to fumbling around with the husband, ex husband, you get so used to husband and then ex husband is what society makes us think we have to say. But we can say, actually, whatever we want.
Dr. Sari Green
Well, and also, what is it right, because the ex husband that's in relation to me, right, like the relationship and I have a relationship with him now, right? Like, if we have kids, we are going to it's you don't it doesn't, it's not gone? Right. But what is that relationship? My relationship now is? He's my son's dad. Right? And, and being clear on that helps make all the other parts clear. How does the communication happen? Where are the boundaries? What does this look like? What are the priorities, all of that is encapsulated within these my kids, dad, right? There's like, a lot that comes with that. And it kind of helps make it clear. Whereas, you know, are throwing the word husband in there, like that's about us now. And it's not about us anymore at all.
Dr. Prianca Naik
Yes, that there is no us in that way.
Dr. Sari Green
Fisher shift, right. It's a shift that you have to kind of consciously go through as you're letting your life go, letting your old life go and creating your new life. You know, you're kind of in this limbo place for a while. And how can you get through that Limbo place? In an increasingly intentional way?
Dr. Prianca Naik
I love Yes, the limbo, like when you file versus when maybe it's finalized, or even just as you're changing who you are, because it is that identity shift into single parent, I actually wanted to touch upon something you said a little bit in the beginning said in the beginning, about you said I don't want to sugarcoat this for people. And I think it's really important for people to know that the process of divorce is very painful. So just know that it is a pain, you will experience all the grief the loss, like we talked about, it's like a death and but also realizing that it will pass. Right, the divorce paying likely won't last your lifetime. Yes. Can you tell us about that in terms of grieving and giving people a bit of a timeline? Because I personally, I love a timeline. I love knowing what to expect. So if you could just give us like a little bit of maybe what you felt like your process was in that?
Dr. Sari Green
Yeah, I don't know if I can give a timeline. I think it probably varies. Mine felt long. But as I look back, there were kind of milestones along the way that I didn't necessarily recognize as they were happening, right. But I recognize them looking back where the shifts were right, and it kind of gets to a place it got to a point where I was actually like, looking back and realizing I'm kind of on the other side of this. Now it doesn't go away completely ever. There's like threads of it, right? And there's not that, you know, there's no, they're there. But it's, it's trusting that you are moving through it, and trusting that it is impermanent. And like you said, allowing yourself to feel the feelings that come with it. Right, I think we have this idea that life is supposed to be happy all the time. And we are supposed to you know, and so that's not what this feels like, right? But it doesn't mean something's gone wrong. This is a dark, hard, you know, there's hard chapters in life. And this is really one of them. Probably one of the hardest, maybe the hardest for some people, right? Definitely the hardest thing I've ever been through. But there's an additional layer of suffering I think that comes with it when we are constantly thinking it shouldn't be like this, I shouldn't be I get that sometimes often when I start with a new client, I will get you know, one of the things that they say or they write on their intake form is you know, I try to be happy but I just don't feel like I can be happy you know, I'm trying to be kind of you know, and and maybe just accepting, like just being where we are. You know, the concept of you know, what we resist persists. This kind of idea of we have to push it away and try and try not to feel it right you know it I think if we give our I think there's also a fear that if we fully feel it, we're just gonna get swallowed up, like forever. But that doesn't happen. You know, I think what I will often suggest to people to do is to really find, like a time that you just sit with it, and you feel it and you identify how it feels in your body. Okay, what am I feeling now? What is okay? That's fear, where does the where's the fear, okay, that's, I feel the fear in my chest, it feels like you know, and, and to just identify kind of the physiological pieces that come with it and kind of gain awareness around it. And what happens with that, it seems, is that it then just starts to dissipate. You know, I had a, I remember. I met a woman, when my son was to in she was a single mom also. And our kids were in preschool together. And she had two of them. She had twins, she had twin two year olds, and I had one two year old and I was pretty sure I was gonna die all the time. And everything was hard. And everything was just like, you know, it was everything was just hard. And you remember, she was frazzled, right, like as anybody with a little kids are, but she didn't have that extra weight. And I, I noticed it and I in and I started thinking about it, and she had chosen to become a single mom died, but she she did it on her own. And I think the piece that was different there is I still very much had this constant running narrative in my head, every time something was hard, that it wasn't supposed to be like this, it wasn't supposed to be like this. And that added such a weight, an extra layer of suffering to what was already hard, right. And she didn't have that piece. And and it was really interesting. Because I eventually came to a place where I could fully believe it was supposed to be like this, because this is how it is. And that chef was super liberating. To me, it didn't make the day to day of doing all the things by myself. And you know, it didn't make that easier. But that extra weight of like, Oh, it wasn't supposed to be like this, I'm not supposed to have to take out the trash. Well, I'm carrying the baby and he weighed, you know, like, just all those things that make it hard. You know, my resistance and my narrative about it, I think added to it. And it's you know, everybody's going to have that it's a natural and normal part of this process. But also, the more we're aware of it, and the more that we can choose our narrative, the more we can kind of create what our story is going forward.
Dr. Prianca Naik
I couldn't agree with you more I talked a lot about in previous podcast episodes as well, but just being able to sit with your emotions, because actually the most streamline streamline process for you people who like to do things efficiently, is to actually feel the emotion, let it in. And then you can really move through it and realize that it's not as scary as you think. Or it's not harming you, or you know, swallowing you a pole, like you said, and also the idea of being on a journey, because you talk about you said, you know, you're talking about how it wasn't supposed to be like this. And of course, so many people feel that way. Because in a way, it wasn't supposed to be like this, you supposed to be married forever. That's what our concept is. But the idea that whatever's happening in our lives for good or bad, even if it's painful, or even if it sucks, or it feels like Oh, other people aren't dealing with this. Those are the things that take us to the next place. Take us to the next step. I wonder if you would you would you say that your experience here brought you to coaching as well because when one goes through this kind of upheaval, you really have to dig deep and do the personal development and personal growth to come out thriving on the other side, and without that you will you can drown. So in terms of this is not how it's supposed to be adding an extra layer of suffering because whatever we are resistance causes so much grief. Right? But if we can accept it and realize that we're all on a journey, changing and growing, and that this is helping us perhaps in whatever way
Dr. Sari Green
Yes. This is definitely what brought me to coaching. I didn't know coaching existed before. Um, it was kind of in a roundabout way. I didn't necessarily think you know, okay, I'm going through the heart this hard thing. I'm going to find a coach I, what I did do, increasingly, and this has been one of the biggest gifts, sorry, I'm going a little bit on a tangent, and you can bring me back after I got off on this tangent. But one of the biggest gifts in all of this was really getting in touch and trusting my own intuition. And in that is, I think how my coaching journey kind of started, I, I've done a lot of different kinds of coaching, I've done physician coaching, non physician coaching, I've done group coaching, I've done individual coaching, I've done a number of kind of yoga based coaching programs, I didn't even know initially that they were called coaching, but when I look back, that's totally what it all was. And for me, the very first one was, was programmed through my yoga studio that I just was really drawn to try. And it was ridiculous, like I was, I had zero time and couldn't even manage anything. I literally, like, my hair was on fire. And so looking at the schedule for this thing I was like, that's, it's not possible. But I also just for some reason, really wanted to do it. And so I did it. And kind of learning to follow my gut on things like that, and not having not having to kind of understand the whole big picture, just like okay, this is what feels right, right now, this is what I'm gonna do. That's kind of how it started. And then I hired a career coach to try and because, you know, trying to figure out how you can, you know, envision a different type of work situation that would match my, my, how I wanted to live now as a single mom with a baby, you know? And then it all kind of progressed to ultimately, you know, me going through coach training. And, and yeah, you know, I obviously live very much in this world now. But yeah, it wasn't so much intentional at the time. But I very much recognize how all of those pieces kind of built up to help me move through it in an increasingly aware and increasingly intentional way. Really, with the idea of, yeah, this is a journey. And this is where I am, right? It's like, it really starts with acceptance, and kind of one of the fundamental pieces of coaching is like fighting with reality, right? Like, that's a losing battle. This is how it is like I can, I can spend all my time spinning and how it should have been, but that's not going to get me anywhere. And that really helps with kids too. And we haven't really talked about this yet. But you know, when we go through a divorce with children, one of the fears that we hear all the time is, how is it going to impact the kids and you hear all kinds of variations of this, right? I can protect them better, if I stay together, I want to stay together, you know, so that they grow up in an intact family, even though this is an abusive situation, you know, there's all kinds of iterations depending on people's situations, but that's a really big piece of it, but kind of looking at life as a journey, and in our kids journeys to right, like this is part of their journey.
About Dr. Sari Green:
Dr. Sari Green is a physician with a background in both Traditional Chinese Medicine and western medicine. She is a single mom, certified life coach, and general surgeon, now working non-clinically as a subject matter expert in CDI. She created Lotus Coaching to help women shift from surviving to thriving through big, disorienting life transitions.
With extensive experience with addiction, infidelity, and high-conflict divorce, Dr. Green works with women who want to uncover the infinite possibility buried under the ruins of their dismantled reality. She provides 1:1 coaching helping clients release the past, reclaim the present, and create a bright and beautiful future.
Dr. Sari Green can be reached at:
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